Is Pangaea heading in a positive direction?

[Palma]

For me the issue was never the lack of religions. Personally I prefer without...

For example, I spent days hunting for keltrunius with my dragon. Next I hear necros wont be able to use Royal and kelt gets a nerf rendering all my ammount useless. That would be okay if it was the first time, but it's not, its constant and no matter how many Years pass, it keeps on going. You are constantly "surviving" these changes. And more annoyingly, you are forced to enter discussions at the forums because if you don't, they change quicker. So it's 80% forum and 20% doing things that end up being useless.

On top of that, you get insults and daily harrassed because you pvp.

There's no incentives to hunt as a group. Dungeons are harder and harder to try and make people hunt as a group but what that causes is people not to be able to hunt them. Then the only few who can and have more time for this do them all the time. And the fewer players they take, the more profitable it is, so they don't invite you and I would do the same if I could. And when you do find the time, group to go hunt and enough items for it, they are already cleared.

There is no motive once so ever to have fun here. Everything is drama, everything is a reason to get insults, everything is in the wrong direction and the real problems are not even recognized. In my humble opinion, religions won't make me come play again at least.

When the staff is so susceptible to player's manipulation on the forums and their arguments of how this and that should change and get nerfed, it forces us players who just want to try and play with what we got to have fun, to go to the forum and defend why it should stay as it is. It's annoying and no one has a life for that anymore. The little time you have you want to PLAY, not spend it at the forum discussing things that are important for your 20% game time, with idiots.

If you find a way to rule out the annoying forum sarcasm, stop forcing players to discuss on the forum because of possible changes on things, and I for one will come play.

My other suggestions would be:
-Increse ore veins - Drops prices; lowers problems like getting looted and it's 3 weeks of your time that just got poof; lowers issues of people that have alt smiths owning all while others don't
-Change or don't change dungeons but make a final decision and all that is related to PVM. Stop the constant change and need to discuss at forum.
-Increase cloth drops - Its causing absurd prices and is directly related to the issue I mentioned above of only a few people being able to do high end mobs and dungeons; lowers the problems of getting looted, loss feeling and -hate-.

I believe changing these would cause people to actually enjoy hunting again, hate less when they die in a dungeon and see their items looted, be afraid that now that they learned how to hunt that dungeon, it will get changed, be less afraid to go and try pvp with good armors instead of hating it because you can only try in radlius and you get instants.

In my example, I ain't invited for big hunts because I don't have a few certain class chars and tons of free time, I can't and don't want to spend large hours daily doing small hunts, and when I do them for the sake of getting a good armor, it gets nerfed and the only way I could do it before, gets nerfed, then I get gang banged and lose the armor thinking it will take me weeks again to get another just for the sake of another one hour pvp when I get gang banged again and on top of that, insulted by people. I'm sure others are familiar with this feeling. It is literally impossible for most players to play Pangaea right now and have fun. I much rather play HON where I just fight random guys 45 mins of pure fun and that's it! I continue with my daily working life.

In short, start going on the opposite direction always gone. Make the game less brutal and more dynamic and fun. 90% of the players here are not at school anymore when we could just skip classes and play 24/7. And the game was still a lot easier back then than it is now.

Look at hybrid for example, anyone can make a good gear to pvp in a couple hours, it's FULL all the time. But then, if you want a big ass house and cool colored clothers, you need to be rich! But having a big or small house doesn't affect the things you like to do, which is pvm and pvp. Causes dynamic and everyone fights and hunts. Not saying it should be like that, but a little step towards that direction for sure.

[Quintoz]

Bruh, ive heard that "rest of the people that are training" for like 6 years by now. You all can train at the moment with that online count:1. After it hits PvP it goes down, everyone ded.

I think he meant the people who have trained after the item wipe. Would they loose the skills etc?

Yep.

@Palma started writing a reply but game design is much more complex if you want to make the shard intresting, fun and rewarding long term and I don't think I could properly convey it without hurting some feels.

[James Blackburn]

Nope, go back to a save before the item wipe if one exists, make 2 religion, gogo pvp.

+

If you want your items back, work for them, then get the pvp you want. You can get pvp without religions. I understand when people have religious chars and would want to use them for pvp, but what about the rest of the people that have been trying to train something in the meantime?

do you really think i quoted it cause of items?

[Sane]

imo the main thing here is that we are in 2016 and not 2001 anymore.

We keep on trying to answer the same question over the years: How can we make a completly dated game be more interesting to new people?

Short answer: we can't!!

Most of us that played here in good old days are not teenagers anymore with lots of time in our hands. I still play games daily but since my time is limited I want to make sure that when I play i'm having fun and beeing engaged.

I've tried to come back to pang a few months back due to pure nostalgia and this is the shard i've found:

- Drama dominates the forums either due to class changes, religions or PvP.

- We still need to macro our asses off to get anywhere.

- Various item wipes, this destroys people's will to play here. The first thing you look in an MMO is persistence, and looking at Pang's history you don't have that.

- Hardly any RP. People just use external programs to chat and meet. The few times I interacted with people the conversation weren't very long nor interesting.

- Itemization and progress is very dependent on other players. This great if you have a thriving comunity but with the lack of players it's very hard to have access to certain items.

Please don't get me wrong i'm not trying to hate on Pang, it's just that it's systems are soooooo dated that is very hard to play in 2016. Maybe instead of trying to focus on bringing new people to the shard we should focus on making the lives of people that still play a lot easier by streamlining some processes.

[Gurrnutt Venomblade]

Please don't get me wrong i'm not trying to hate on Pang, it's just that it's systems are soooooo dated that is very hard to play in 2016. Maybe instead of trying to focus on bringing new people to the shard we should focus on making the lives of people that still play a lot easier by streamlining some processes.

++1

[Glarundis]

The little time you have you want to PLAY

lowers problems like getting looted and it's 3 weeks of your time that just got poof

I believe changing these would cause people to actually enjoy hunting again, hate less when they die in a dungeon and see their items looted, be afraid that now that they learned how to hunt that dungeon, it will get changed, be less afraid to go and try pvp with good armors instead of hating it because you can only try in radlius and you get instants.

I much rather play HON where I just fight random guys 45 mins of pure fun and that's it! I continue with my daily working life.

I still play games daily but since my time is limited I want to make sure that when I play i'm having fun and beeing engaged.

4

Exactly. I've said this so many times, making stuff easier to obtain and easier to lose while not being much of a hassle is what makes people want to log in without feeling it's a grind. That's why I play soldat, that's why I'm trying that new slither game, that's why ppl play fps games. There is a reward for playing more (you get better, obviously) and there's a penalty for dying (respawn time, losing the match, whatever) but the penalty isn't so great that people think "ok..either i have 1000 hours to waste on this or i'm never gonna get there". This isn't necessarily too bad considering this is supposed to be a long term mmorpg and I don't want pangaea on easy mode. But it's definately wrong thinking when you can lose those 1000 hours in 10 minutes. Nothing like this exists in any of those games that people play. If you die, you don't win (lol), but it's no biggie, a few seconds later you're trying again.

Darian mentioned these kind of issues many years ago, when pvm was just getting harder while not giving better rewards, and the whole 110% skill is what 100% used to be, yada yada



So:

1- Everything needs to be easier to obtain, but also easier to lose, namely in pvm. It's just about finding the right balance point. If you get something in a few hunts you don't mind as much when losing it in pvp and you also don't get so mad if somehow some random monster happens to spawn and destroy all your gear, because "oh well, i'll hunt this a few more times and get it all back"

2- For the people out there that want to be on the upper hand all the time, what's so wrong in giving more people a chance to pvp on your level of skills/items? Afraid you'll be losing more often once they use their time to learn tactics instead of wasting all that time in macroing/pvm'ing? Actually you should have more fun winning in pvp against people that have the same starting point.

3- Basically it takes too long to reach a level, compared to how easily it can all go away. That's the exact opposite of what makes stuff addictive. Quick reward.


But this whole thing would be a shitstorm to fix, with all the economy and stuff..Looking forward to hear more opinions

[Gurrnutt Venomblade]

The little time you have you want to PLAY

lowers problems like getting looted and it's 3 weeks of your time that just got poof

I believe changing these would cause people to actually enjoy hunting again, hate less when they die in a dungeon and see their items looted, be afraid that now that they learned how to hunt that dungeon, it will get changed, be less afraid to go and try pvp with good armors instead of hating it because you can only try in radlius and you get instants.

I much rather play HON where I just fight random guys 45 mins of pure fun and that's it! I continue with my daily working life.

I still play games daily but since my time is limited I want to make sure that when I play i'm having fun and beeing engaged.

4

Exactly. I've said this so many times, making stuff easier to obtain and easier to lose while not being much of a hassle is what makes people want to log in without feeling it's a grind. That's why I play soldat, that's why I'm trying that new slither game, that's why ppl play fps games. There is a reward for playing more (you get better, obviously) and there's a penalty for dying (respawn time, losing the match, whatever) but the penalty isn't so great that people think "ok..either i have 1000 hours to waste on this or i'm never gonna get there". This isn't necessarily too bad considering this is supposed to be a long term mmorpg and I don't want pangaea on easy mode. But it's definately wrong thinking when you can lose those 1000 hours in 10 minutes. Nothing like this exists in any of those games that people play. If you die, you don't win (lol), but it's no biggie, a few seconds later you're trying again.

Darian mentioned these kind of issues many years ago, when pvm was just getting harder while not giving better rewards, and the whole 110% skill is what 100% used to be, yada yada



So:

1- Everything needs to be easier to obtain, but also easier to lose, namely in pvm. It's just about finding the right balance point. If you get something in a few hunts you don't mind as much when losing it in pvp and you also don't get so mad if somehow some random monster happens to spawn and destroy all your gear, because "oh well, i'll hunt this a few more times and get it all back"

2- For the people out there that want to be on the upper hand all the time, what's so wrong in giving more people a chance to pvp on your level of skills/items? Afraid you'll be losing more often once they use their time to learn tactics instead of wasting all that time in macroing/pvm'ing? Actually you should have more fun winning in pvp against people that have the same starting point.

3- Basically it takes too long to reach a level, compared to how easily it can all go away. That's the exact opposite of what makes stuff addictive. Quick reward.


But this whole thing would be a shitstorm to fix, with all the economy and stuff..Looking forward to hear more opinions

couldnt agree more, a simple tweak of the loot pools would fix this problem. We are all sitting and waiting for religions to be release which I understand will take sometime due to the re-writing some codes that other scripters in the past have written. Bottom line is a we wont keep the players we have if we arent having fun..... As we have seen since the launch, we went from 30+ players on at one time to 1-3. If the staff needs help writing code maybe some players can help that have knowledge of this, if none of us players cared we wouldnt be taking a poll or giving ideas on how the server can be moved in a positive direction. Lets make pang fun once again even if we have to sacrifice a couple more months of no religions. Or maybe introducing religion package with basic rites nothing worth pvp at the moment just to promote the religions just a thought.

[Demian]

1- Everything needs to be easier to obtain, but also easier to lose, namely in pvm. It's just about finding the right balance point. If you get something in a few hunts you don't mind as much when losing it in pvp and you also don't get so mad if somehow some random monster happens to spawn and destroy all your gear, because "oh well, i'll hunt this a few more times and get it all back"

2- For the people out there that want to be on the upper hand all the time, what's so wrong in giving more people a chance to pvp on your level of skills/items? Afraid you'll be losing more often once they use their time to learn tactics instead of wasting all that time in macroing/pvm'ing? Actually you should have more fun winning in pvp against people that have the same starting point.

3- Basically it takes too long to reach a level, compared to how easily it can all go away. That's the exact opposite of what makes stuff addictive. Quick reward.

I can't agree with this. If anything, things are already a little too easy on pang and once you get your giant bone set for ~400k, which is cheap as hell, and the most essential clothes, you have nothing more to work towards except grind for PvP gear without much worry. I simply don't see where the fun would be in a game where reaching the "top" level is fast and everything is easy to obtain, even more so than it already is. I think there is a reason we aren't all playing on those shards where you just pick up the best items from a table for free and go do your thing. Reaching the top fast and having nothing more to do is the opposite of addictive. Even if you face a loss it doesn't matter because the risk-reward aspect of the game is completely demolished, it gets boring quickly and is the same reason why I can't find enjoyment from games like WoW for long and I'd imagine I'm not alone on pang with that opinion.

[Sane]

Usually I don't voice my opinion on this matter as this is something that has been said that will never change.

The skill gain system / Macrocheck system

When I started here this system made sense. If this is a game that i'll be playing for years why should I have everything right away?

If you think about it on paper it sounds great! You advance you character by doing the exact action that a real person would to improve that specific skill. This seems a lot more engaging than say pay a certain NPC to level/gain skills.

The problem here is that the number of times we have to repeat the same action to get the minimum amount of skills gain is absurd, specially if you do it by hand.

Macroing skills is the only option we have if we wanna have semi decent char, which like you all know can't be done unattained. One could argue that macroing is not needed to enjoy the game but I disagree completly! Macroing and powerleveling is encouraged by the staff, how you ask? Pretty simple answer: by making most monsters/dungeons completly unkillable by an semi-trained char. I do love to RP and met new people but in the end what makes me play a game is the character advancement, the loot, the personal achivements, etc... and here the only way to get there on smallest time frame possible is by macroing.

So what i'm trying to say is that this game can be very fun, if you can stomach an repeatitive and boring mechanic for at least 6 months (i'm talking a normal working/family person). As time passes less and less people have the patience and will to make it to the fun part, and tbh I don't blame them....

Think of any game released over the last 10 years and think about how you character advances in it. Imagine if you bought/downloaded the game and instead of jumping into the fun part, the devs ask you to do a boring task which takes like 6 months and only THEN you have the chance to get to the fun part. I know RPG's are ment to start slow and with humble begginings but this is WAY too slow... If you tried to sell this game to anyone you would be next to EA and Ubisoft in no time

I'm don't want to sound negative and I thank every GM/Admin for the lovely times i've spent here but I really think you're trying to drive the vets away instead of trying to keep the ones that still have the will to stick around.

Sorry for the long post! (it's been a slow day at work )

[Cyrus Tegyr]

We'll I scanned through a good number of the latter posts and to the original reason of this thread there's no idea for us to know which way Pangaea is moving, it has been a rudderless ship these past few months and what was done save for a few small things were bug fixes that should have never been present in the first place.

I think there's is something to be discussed here when referring to loot pools, the loot tables need to seriously looked at and that's something any of the staff can do anytime, there is 0 Zero scripting involved in looking at and adjusting loot pools, it baffles me that simple things like this any staff member can do if they're given access to the cfg files as well as probably a database of the item types defined in itemdesc.cfg files through out the shards file structures.

Dungeons really out to be finalized at some point I agree this incessant changing and tweaking of dungeons to make them ever tougher thus less profitable in the long run needs to be stopped. Personally there's a couple dungeons out there id like to remodel but this is not what I mean, adding and removing of chests or switching in harder mobs for easier mobs needs to go. Minor tweaks are one thing but it has become out of control within the last staff and I'm not sure what if any this staff has planned.

In terms of dungeon structure. I've always advocated if things need to be changed we ought to have more puzzle dungeons as opposed to hack n slash style, yes mobs that attack but have riddles that need to be solved before progressing on, adopt the osi style puzzle boxes and add a larger variety of traps not always deadly ones but just to spice dungeons up. In terms of hunting in general, let's fix pets so that when they kill something the corpse is able to be opened, I control a pet it's basically my wing man why can't I open a corpse of something he has killed if I haven't first hit it yet, makes no sense.

Finally, religions do play a big part in Pangaea whether certain people care to agree with this or not, these need to be finished as there are four classes out in the wild left sitting because they were balanced with a time in mind and well, guess what, no tomes to be had yet.

Typed on my phone so forgive my mistakes and I've probably left stuff out but I agree with some of what has been said.