Two Religions - 1 Land

[Glarundis]

As it is now, Tekstone is the only religion that kills or at least killed a lot of random people and guilds

yes this is what i was talking about
you know, some quite active guild that suddenly...

but it's in the past now

[Akkarrin]

would be interesting but id suggest making two completely new religions from scratch and just having a purely good religion and a purely evil religion and must be 100% pvp orientated, and not too good at pvm... and as always the good religion has to have some sort of advantage over evil

will never happen, but good to dream

[Darian Darkmind]

Guild vs Guild
Religion vs Religion

That I like. No mix.

I'm just gonna say this again.

Punishment for religions interfering in the wars with guilds.

Would make the game extremely boring. There's guilds and then there's two religions. Religions fight only against each other and that's that. Whee? Not.

I don't know if I'm bad at explaining it or if people are just misunderstanding it.

We would start by having two religions: Gaea and Dennac. Neither of the religions is good or evil and both have the same powers. Being good or evil is up to players to decide. Some believe Dennac is wrongly fighting against Gaea where as some believe Gaea is a criminal and Dennac's actions are just. Of course Dennac would no longer use plague or destruction to get his message through. There would be no more killing innocent random players. Instead we'd change the tome to be more "player friendly" equal to Nature's.

Both of these religions fight for support. Not for kingdoms, but for people's faith. Both want people to accept their god as the only true god and banish the other god from this world. They try to convert as many people as possible into their faith. They try to help people and guilds in order to gain their support. Once gained they try to turn them against the other god. Some might join arms and fight against the other god whereas some just refuse to work with his supporters - sell items, help them, hunt with them etc. Some might not do anything even if he believes in one god. Most players would remain neutral and won't take part to the god's power-struggle at all.

Guilds and players choose themselves whether they accept a god into their heart. If they do, they might gain something for it: What ever the religion players promise them - if they can keep their promises, that is. If the religion fails to provide what is promised, the people can abandon their faith - or worse, change it to the other god.

I repeat religions would not automatically interfere with two guilds at war. At no point should religion players just join a fight and kill people in guilds just because "they can". They don't care if two groups are killing each other. However should one of the guilds place their faith and pray for one of the gods to help them, the religion can then CHOOSE to aid them. After all, the religions are fighting for the people's FAITH. They want supporters and followers. Helping those in need is a good way to gain supporters. Of course by accepting to help the guild, they have to choose whether they actually give them PvP help or not, because if they do, the other guild is sure to turn away from them. The other guild might be bigger and stronger and the religion would rather want their support, or better yet both guild's support. So accepting to help the smaller guild, especially in PvP-wise just because they ask for it might not be a smart move. By doing so they might make the other, the bigger guild seek help from the other religion and thus strengthening them. And that's not what they want - they rather refuse to help the guild than risk strengthening their enemy: The other religion.

Nothing should be black and white, nothing should be evil or good, it should all be decided by us. Our actions should determine our destiny. Players can choose to believe or choose not to believe. Religions can choose to help those who believe, or refuse to help them if they are not worth of their time.

You, Mike as someone who appreciates RP should understand this.

[Vaux27]

D2 FFS CLIFF NOTES US FOR ONCEE!!!!!!!!





Short summaries, you make 100% sense but we can't be bothered with reading all of that mate.

[Darian Darkmind]

It is very short and summarized. Some people write one phrase without ever explaining as to WHY that is his opinion.

Of course it's faster to read those, but I want to know WHY someone thinks one way is better than the other. I at least provide the reasoning and examples. It's a sad day when people stop making arguments to back their idea and opinion. Any kind of retard can vote but saying yes or no means absolutely nothing if you can't back it up with reasons. "I say yes because I dislike the word no", is not a valid reason.

If I say I want two religions to fight each other and then guilds running the kingdoms, sure it's that short and quick. But do you know why I want it? No. I don't know why Johnny or Mike don't want guilds and religions to mix. They've given no reasoning to it. They must think it wouldn't work. At least I'm giving reasoning why it should happen and why it would enhance the RP of this shard. Without religions interfering with other people and guilds, there's no point to have the religions at all.

[Zaradon]

In my opinion, we should move on.

Due to all the warfare between Gaea and Dennac, i think there needs to be an end since we're getting bored.
One end, is a new start for something new.

I'd rather see 2 sub religions and 2 main religions.

Sub religions, would give more use/benefit for non piety classes. Probably could work like Holy Guilds.

But myeah, i guess it'll never happen.

[Johnny Walac]

I don't want religion and guild to mix because the religion got a tome and will be stronger then the guild. If the religion is stronger and PvP against guilds, people would just join the religion.

Example:

My guild got a city. And unless I suck the cock of Dacca, the religion will come rape me.
Huge no.

Keep religions out of it. I can agree on a RP reason behind it.

Example:

My guild got a city. I like Dacca so I built a church for him. For this, he likes me also.


Edit: If there were 2 religions I wouldn't want Tekstone or Gaea on it anyway. Like I said on UOAM. Evil vs Good is 80's fantasy. Game of Thrones style is in. Kings and Queens, dirty politics and guilds that swear alliegence to them. But on Pangaea, guilds that take over the cities.

[Darian Darkmind]

Oh and it is also important that neither religion have the "salvation" or guards ritual. Instead every player is forced to follow the law of the kings. These laws are upheld by guilds and regular players. Guilds and players in charge can hold trials for known criminals.

Even if a religion would think the laws of men are below the laws of gods, the religion would try to respect the law set by the kings, because they want to convert people into their faith. If the guards kill them on sight, they have hard time preaching to people.

[Zaradon]

Smells like a big win for robbers on this one.
Maybe we could have 2 religions, yes - merge lawture and impstone, i dont know.
I'm not an expert in the PvP rules, but i dislike the abuse of the "missing" rules.

I'm not pointing fingers but i dont see anything great in this since the religious would be restricted to less variety to more PvP.

Yes, we need something to make the non-piety classes playable, but not that religions overwhelm them in every aspect, it's just not right.

[Darian Darkmind]

I don't want religion and guild to mix because the religion got a tome and will be stronger then the guild. If the religion is stronger and PvP against guilds, people would just join the religion.

Example:

My guild got a city. And unless I suck the cock of Dacca, the religion will come rape me.
Huge no.

Keep religions out of it. I can agree on a RP reason behind it.

Example:

My guild got a city. I like Dacca so I built a church for him. For this, he likes me also.


Edit: If there were 2 religions I wouldn't want Tekstone or Gaea on it anyway. Like I said on UOAM. Evil vs Good is 80's fantasy. Game of Thrones style is in. Kings and Queens, dirty politics and guilds that swear alliegence to them.

Like I said, if you only read, is that there aren't good or evil. It's up to players to see the gods as they are. Both gods are at war with each other with a reason. Both blame each other for their Father's death. Both have equal tome and neither have "evil" rituals like plague in it.

Also, like I said if you had a town, Tekstone and Nature would try to preach to you as to why you should believe in their god. You can refuse as much as you want. Of course either religion can try force it to you and attack you, but by doing so they go red and is therefore making it very hard to preach in any town after that. Not only that, by attacking you they risk making you their enemy. In worst case of scenario you can pledge allegiance to the other god instead. So yes, the religion could in theory fight against you and kill you, but that would be VERY STUPID from them. That would make the religion look tyrannic and evil by everyone's eyes which is something they don't want. They want everyone to see the OTHER religion as evil.

It is important that neither religion is EVIL or GOOD by default. Both religions will be viewed by the actions of the players in it. If the players want to turn it into a evil and tyrannic religion, let them, but they are only digging their own grave. If they fail at war, there can be a revolution and someone else takes over the religions. They seek for salvation and forgivness and will continue on more peaceful manners.