More robbers?

[Glarundis]

It was your choice to join religion while being after piety and its powers to begin with, here is where you pay for the advantages that piety gives. Just live with it.

I pay for the piety with many restrictions to the religious char in question. Theres no reason for it to affect the RP of my alts.

exactly

the piety restrictions that that character has is the con for the pros of the piety.
the alt chars shouldn't have to suffer because of an alt char's piety!

if the piety restrictions are what they should be on chars that use piety, now that is another question (piety penalty timers disappearing is just one example)

[Demian]

if the piety restrictions are what they should be on chars that use piety, now that is another question (piety penalty timers disappearing is just one example)

Well, the penalty timers were removed to give people a bit more freedom which I think is a good thing. Double timers were honestly too big of a punishment. Especially when you get autokicked from a religion if you go inactive for a while. I meant more like the restrictions to the character when you are in a religion, following pretty much a set in stone RP. Like as I'm Law I can give good example of that by having to constantly do trials. Gets quite exhausting when you gotta arrange trials multiple times a week and listening the same stories from everyone. And if you deny the salvation, the whines are unbelieveable. But I'm not whining don't get me wrong. That's a part of being in Law and I'm fine with it. But it's just an example of the things that people in religions have to do to earn that piety. And the piety doesn't come for free in the first place. It's 134 days to get 40 piety, and I don't personally even grant it to people who only log on for piety rises and I'm sure other religions do the same. And Knights and Rangers these days even have to apply for that 40 piety.

I really don't see any issues with that idea Cirre posted. I think we should try that. Staff will have a big say on the robber alts of religious people and if they have any issues with the actions of any person they can just deny him from robbing. I'm sure that would make people behave due to being watched by the staff to play to the standards they request of robbers. And imo the staff could be very strict on it.

[Ricardus]

I choose the last option, because i think all players that have religion chars should be allowed to have robber/red chars, or none should. I'm all up to balance things like some of you already know.
If you are in a religion you can prety much do what you want..if not, take this as example:

Imperial can kill and dryloot averyone that goes against their godess rules, meaning anyone that goes against them or who simply is not devoted to their godess.

Law goes against Tekstone and Imperial, and general criminal chars, and have that conflit ritual that with good and justified rp, allows them to loot anyone they want.
However Law are the only ones that can't have a robber char.

Nature is like the peacefull religion, but they are natural enemies of Tekstone, so they can kill and loot any of them, they can also kill necros and random characters that goes against their religion code (i mean ppl that harms animals, plague cites etc).

Tekstone are the badass religion, they can prety much kill and dry loot everyone they want.

Get what i'm trying to say here?

[Nymphea]

Demian: if Law decided to make a robber guild on their alts, who could hunt you down, since Law is logged on alts to do the robbing?

This can't happen. So IMO, cause of this sole reason, religious accounts shouldn't be allowed to have robbing chars.

[Demian]

Demian: if Law decided to make a robber guild on their alts, who could hunt you down, since Law is logged on alts to do the robbing?

This can't happen. So IMO, cause of this sole reason, religious accounts shouldn't be allowed to have robbing chars.

All other religions would. And anyway, I doubt many people in Law would even make robber alts.

[Cruxis Bane]

I agree the restrictions suck and should never be put into place. I blame this hugely on the fact that us as players don't see this as just a game and arn't willing to kill and loot or be killed and looted by a friend. The main issue with this imo besides the shard remaining divided or people leaving religions because they got robbed by someone else in it is not all religions have the rites to deal with robbers mainly malleus and the fact that if we can have robbers imperial would have robbers that mainly robbed nature/law and possibly tek and each religion the same way which still leaves the shard divided.

As far as the non religion vs religion that ivan is bitching about you just need to do better with your barb or something then, I very rarely see you die in pvp while I see religious chars go down quite often. And from personal experience with my 50 piety legendary priest it is so much easier fighting another religous character even zarecks priest than fighting a non religious char like his assassin.

[Darian Darkmind]

My first thought was no due to the same reason Cirius said.

After reading through the first posts, I first thought that maybe we could have more robbers indeed. Then I read rest of the comments and it's clear we aren't ready for it.

And as a minor thing that allowing robbers for all would cause is that such alliances (Law+AG+SE or Imp+AP+JL etc) would start to break up and the game would be more versatile.

While this is one possible scenario and while I hope it really would play out like that, still out of experience, it is more likely to work in a way that Law/AG robber alts only rob Tekstone and Imperial players and vica versa.

The fact is people have a tendency to let their friends and all their characters go free. People can claim this to be a player issue, they can claim they would be different, better and they would not meta-game, but so far I've not seen a single robber in my whole ten years of Pangaea that has not been guilty of the above. And I've either fought against, been more or less part of, or had otherwise close ties to almost all robber guilds. Whether they were SoD, Cabals, Exorsus Nox, PoB or someone with no ties to any religion, they still failed to kill and rob their own friends (not to even mention your own member's alts).

The only ones who would really suffer from allowing all robbers are the random people who aren't considered part of either group and thus get robbed by both sides.

Therefore my vote goes for "No religions can have robber alts"

[Jyrgen]

The fact is people have a tendency to let their friends and all their characters go free. People can claim this to be a player issue, they can claim they would be different, better and they would not meta-game, but so far I've not seen a single robber in my whole ten years of Pangaea that has not been guilty of the above. And I've either fought against, been more or less part of, or had otherwise close ties to almost all robber guilds. Whether they were SoD, Cabals, Exorsus Nox, PoB or someone with no ties to any religion, they still failed to kill and rob their own friends (not to even mention your own member's alts).

The only ones who would really suffer from allowing all robbers are the random people who aren't considered part of either group and thus get robbed by both sides.

I agree with Darian here. In my opinion, this has always been the main problem of those religion/group based robber guilds.

[Siren]

Part of me wants to see more robbers and part of me doesn't so I am left mostly undecided however after thinking about the case of allowing all religions to have robber alts I thought that as long as there are restriction/special rules to deal with them it MAY be OK.
I have thought of a few possibilities and decided to throw them out there, although I see problems either way.

1.
If a religious character has a robber alt he/she must act in the same way towards members of the religion his other character is in, an example is Law as part of their role-play should have to fight a red character regardless of the situation and if they are ever caught not doing so they are kicked from the religion. The other three religions should have it slightly less strict and should only need to attack a robber if in an area controlled by them.
Of course something like this has problem as if a robber flees from the religion character he/she may only chase semi seriously if it is a friend.

2.
If religion characters are allowed to make robber alts I would be tempted to make it so that the Head priest and 2nd in the religion can not also you can only have 40 piety max if you have a robber alt.

3.
Another idea I thought up is that perhaps robbers should have to fill a quota if they have a character in a religion such as 2 robberies against their religion each month etc and the items taken would have to be put up for public auction. Of-course once again there are problems with this such as someone getting purposely robbed while only having a few items on them although maybe it should be necessary to upload a SS of the victims pack.

4.
Bringing back the .robber command does sound like a good idea with a character losing the ability to rob if he does not show that he robs everyone equally and properly roleplays the part of a robber. Anyone who is flagged as a robber should have to upload a screenshot every time they are involved in PvP regardless of whether they attacked or were attacked these should of course show that proper roleplay was used on the robbers side.(Staff do not necessarily have to check these but they should be uploaded to prevent problems)
If you are found out not to have uploaded a screenshot after being in PvP situation then you lose your robber status.


The reasons I am pro allowing religions haveing robber alts is simply due to the fact that I see robbers as part of pang to a degree as well as that fact that rules exist against muling and meta-gaming e.g. knowledge/wealth from one character being used to give another said knowledge/wealth OOC and yet there are also OOC rules stopping one character from robbing because of another character(although I understand the reasons are mostly related to the above two rules)

The reason I am against everyone having robbers is because I do not wish to lose my shinies (that I do no currently have as I have only just come back after being away for 8 years)

p.s. I have never had a robber character

p.s.s. Sorry for the wall of text perhaps I should have used pictures

[Zaradon]

Game mechanics allow them to get away too easy as past has shown.
There is no real point of hunting/grinding if there's many ways for them to escape/logout.


There should be a good game mechanic to prevent robbers logging out immediately after robbing someone.
Perhaps an auto-manhunt aswell.