Bards, Poke' Hunting, Provoke

[Cruxis Bane]

I would say that a bard is still way better probably in my opinion the top PVM class with archer. Being able to sick 2 great dragons on eachother, or two fiends on eachother. Provoking everything besides Caco, Ancient, Royal, Void, and Balron makes you an elite class. Also a Royal Dragon 2 has limits especially considering that Druids can't heal it.

[Kat Asherstone]

I would say that a bard is still way better probably in my opinion the top PVM class with archer. Being able to sick 2 great dragons on eachother, or two fiends on eachother. Provoking everything besides Caco, Ancient, Royal, Void, and Balron makes you an elite class. Also a Royal Dragon 2 has limits especially considering that Druids can't heal it.

In order to sick two greater dragons on each other requires that you are in LoS to both dragons at the same time AND that both dragons are in LoS to each other... so you have to stand between two greater dragons, to maybe kill 1? They will still turn at you when they disengage from each other at low hp

Sooo, Poke Hunting a greater against a greater is a better reward vs risk because spamming all kill is a LOT faster than provocation on two targets.

[Cruxis Bane]

You should watch Biggs Provo Greats then, he is quite proficient at it.

[Kat Asherstone]

You should watch Biggs Provo Greats then, he is quite proficient at it.

Truth be told, I've talked to him about it since he didn't quit for a while like I did... he stated it's Waaaay to risky with the changes to be efficient. O.o

I actually went to him before going into this whole post lol

[Vaux27]

"play your bard a little"

Online time for account: 15 weeks + and that's including not playing for 3 years almost...

I was THE original Bard.
I helped Reppy to change the structure of the bard song list because it was originally WAY OP

Did you know that originally the song of recovery and shielding were flipped? Why did that matter? Oh because a bard starting with 50 music could simply spam recovery and never die to any small things while training fighting skills allowing them to basically power lvl faster than any other class.

I was the first to get anything over 65 provoke, and found the gap.

Did you know that there was originally a gap in provocation that made it so that the amount of creatures that could actually gain provoke beyond 60 was a total of 3. Only one of which was possible to solo tank as a bard, that being the flaming skeletons in Moonglow Gy.

First to provoke giants to fight each other.

Did you know that when you provoke a giant to fight a giant that there used to be a chance that on it's stun/knockback it could disengage causing them to turn and both fight you?
Or that when a bard provokes if the creature runs from the other then it loses the provoke and must either be re-provoked or simply killed by the bard.

Question is, What about priests? I mean priests can still solo things right? When I quit the server it was because while I could force two giants to fight each other, I still had to get lucky that one would die or that I could finish him first... Priests just went in and solo'd them one at a time. I mean lets see if people are willing to list the classes that can solo a giant, I would love to see that list at this juncture in Pang's history cause I think if people are honest theres a few classes that need a goof nerf bat hit too.

Are we suppose to be impressed that you are an oldie?

I see no current problem with Provo quite honestly, you shouldn't be able to provo anything larger than a Great 2. You certainly should have line of sight as well.

[Kat Asherstone]

"play your bard a little"

Online time for account: 15 weeks + and that's including not playing for 3 years almost...

I was THE original Bard.
I helped Reppy to change the structure of the bard song list because it was originally WAY OP

Did you know that originally the song of recovery and shielding were flipped? Why did that matter? Oh because a bard starting with 50 music could simply spam recovery and never die to any small things while training fighting skills allowing them to basically power lvl faster than any other class.

I was the first to get anything over 65 provoke, and found the gap.

Did you know that there was originally a gap in provocation that made it so that the amount of creatures that could actually gain provoke beyond 60 was a total of 3. Only one of which was possible to solo tank as a bard, that being the flaming skeletons in Moonglow Gy.

First to provoke giants to fight each other.

Did you know that when you provoke a giant to fight a giant that there used to be a chance that on it's stun/knockback it could disengage causing them to turn and both fight you?
Or that when a bard provokes if the creature runs from the other then it loses the provoke and must either be re-provoked or simply killed by the bard.

Question is, What about priests? I mean priests can still solo things right? When I quit the server it was because while I could force two giants to fight each other, I still had to get lucky that one would die or that I could finish him first... Priests just went in and solo'd them one at a time. I mean lets see if people are willing to list the classes that can solo a giant, I would love to see that list at this juncture in Pang's history cause I think if people are honest theres a few classes that need a goof nerf bat hit too.

Are we suppose to be impressed that you are an oldie?

I see no current problem with Provo quite honestly, you shouldn't be able to provo anything larger than a Great 2. You certainly should have line of sight as well.

Did I say you should be able to provoke a greater 2? No. In fact Imo, you shouldn't be able to provoke a Great 1 even, it's a Great Dragon, it's not some schmuck it should have been around long enough to laugh at the idea of a song directing him.

Should you have LoS, you bet your sweet as you should.

Should the check be done from the provoke numbers of each mob? No, you're not provoking them against each other, you're provoking one ONTO the other one. It's as simple as that, the change made it so that you don't actually provoke one onto another, you provoke them against each other
BUT WAIT, holy what the hell? You can provoke them back against each other in reverse, but wait a second you just did that... and yet, if you try again in the original order... "you cannot provoke that again so soon"

It should be changed back for the sake of the targetting, the LoS should still apply, the numbers should be raised on higher things... but the fact remains in terms of what is "actually' happening, the skill now does NOT represent that like it used to, Reppy setup provoke like that because he wanted it to be representative of what was being done, did it have problems with the LoS sure, but changing it in this particular way overshot the objective of balance.

That was the goal right? balance provoke?
or maybe it was just to make sure there are no more than 5 heighten bards... ya know while we have 30+ heighten priests...

[Cruxis Bane]

Well if you are complaining about the little amount of heightened bards why dont you look at the classes that have 0 heightened .

Honestly from what I have seen in Provo and Bards they are not just a support class they are quite an amazing class and like I said, in my opinion the top PVM class and not a bad PVP class.

[Vaux27]

Did I say you should be able to provoke a greater 2? No. In fact Imo, you shouldn't be able to provoke a Great 1 even, it's a Great Dragon, it's not some schmuck it should have been around long enough to laugh at the idea of a song directing him.

Should you have LoS, you bet your sweet as you should.

Should the check be done from the provoke numbers of each mob? No, you're not provoking them against each other, you're provoking one ONTO the other one. It's as simple as that, the change made it so that you don't actually provoke one onto another, you provoke them against each other
BUT WAIT, holy what the hell? You can provoke them back against each other in reverse, but wait a second you just did that... and yet, if you try again in the original order... "you cannot provoke that again so soon"

It should be changed back for the sake of the targetting, the LoS should still apply, the numbers should be raised on higher things... but the fact remains in terms of what is "actually' happening, the skill now does NOT represent that like it used to, Reppy setup provoke like that because he wanted it to be representative of what was being done, did it have problems with the LoS sure, but changing it in this particular way overshot the objective of balance.

That was the goal right? balance provoke?
or maybe it was just to make sure there are no more than 5 heighten bards... ya know while we have 30+ heighten priests...

I'm filing you under the Darkmind 80 piety file. TLDR and really don't care enough.

Bards are fine as is currently.

[Kat Asherstone]

Well if you are complaining about the little amount of heightened bards why dont you look at the classes that have 0 heightened .

Honestly from what I have seen in Provo and Bards they are not just a support class they are quite an amazing class and like I said, in my opinion the top PVM class and not a bad PVP class.

Oh I have looked at them, each of them has a particular skill or couple skills that make it such... BUT at heighten they are able to do some pretty crazy things (in theory) except for Scribe... although one has to wonder if maybe they get something craaazy at 105 inscription.

I'm not sure how they can be classified though as top PVM class if they can't solo things that other classes can solo much easier.

I won't say they aren't a decent enough PvP class, cause they can be pretty good unfortunately provoke does not effect pvp, and provoke was the focus.

[Kat Asherstone]

Did I say you should be able to provoke a greater 2? No. In fact Imo, you shouldn't be able to provoke a Great 1 even, it's a Great Dragon, it's not some schmuck it should have been around long enough to laugh at the idea of a song directing him.

Should you have LoS, you bet your sweet as you should.

Should the check be done from the provoke numbers of each mob? No, you're not provoking them against each other, you're provoking one ONTO the other one. It's as simple as that, the change made it so that you don't actually provoke one onto another, you provoke them against each other
BUT WAIT, holy what the hell? You can provoke them back against each other in reverse, but wait a second you just did that... and yet, if you try again in the original order... "you cannot provoke that again so soon"

It should be changed back for the sake of the targetting, the LoS should still apply, the numbers should be raised on higher things... but the fact remains in terms of what is "actually' happening, the skill now does NOT represent that like it used to, Reppy setup provoke like that because he wanted it to be representative of what was being done, did it have problems with the LoS sure, but changing it in this particular way overshot the objective of balance.

That was the goal right? balance provoke?
or maybe it was just to make sure there are no more than 5 heighten bards... ya know while we have 30+ heighten priests...

I'm filing you under the Darkmind 80 piety file. TLDR and really don't care enough.

Bards are fine as is currently.

I think someone doesn't know the meaning of the word discussion

+1 for keeping Pang classy