Before launch

[Quintoz]

I get that, but you chose NOT to character wipe but still you want to put Priests and Monks back to baseclass, which is where I don't understand the thinking.

No one is going to go back to baseclass. Like mentioned above

We are considering to have some sort neutral diety for those piety chars to work on.

A priest without piety is basicly a baseclass character, I'm still confused about the idea that a character wipe is considered too "hardcore" when it takes 2-4 weeks to max one but removing 1year+ of work to get 50 piety is fine.

[Argon]

That can be discussed, although tell us what would you expect.

Starting point: remove Tekstone and Nature due to the player base size.
What happen to piety of Tekstoners and Natures? Will they appear on Law and Imperial as if nothing happened with their full piety? For me there is no logic. Is it fair for them comparing to those that remained on existing religions? No it is not.

What we discussed to do: remove all religions and allow players to work on. This would make more sense RPwise and would put everyone at the same level. It is a bit more fair although of course for those with highest piety it means the most drop.
A neutral deity with no specific god to worship was a thought of a starting point. Easy to make sense RPwise and a starting point to evolve towards other religions.

What happen to piety? Shall there be a transition for those who add it to the neutral deity and then to those going to the newly formed religions? Shall piety be something that is not lost from now on? Which solutions do you suggest?


Argon

[Demian]

What happen to piety? Shall there be a transition for those who add it to the neutral deity and then to those going to the newly formed religions? Shall piety be something that is not lost from now on? Which solutions do you suggest?

Maybe every piety class not in a religion (which is everyone when the shard is restarted) automatically gets put into this "neutral" religion/deity? This way not only Tekstone and Nature loses due to their religions being deleted (which isn't their fault anyway), but everyone get's a fair and equal start. To keep some sort of discouragement to religionhopping, the piety you had is halved and you lose the last page of your tome. When you join a real religion, you get the last page back and you keep the piety you earned in the neutral religion. This way piety will actually have to be earned again (which I think is a good thing. Hell, some were even ready for a full character wipe). Piety in the neutral religion would have to be granted by the staff, or make it possible to grant piety by defigoing (only in the neutral religion).

50p -> 20p with the timer to 30p halved
40p -> 20p
30p -> 10p with timer to 20p halved
20p -> 10p
10p -> 10p

I don't know what to do with 60p but if this idea is acceptable then I suppose it's either that 60p get's treated as 40p, thus getting 20p in neutral religion, or they're treated as 60p and they get 30p in the neutral religion.

I wouldn't like to see this neutral religion become something that players can just choose to be in instead of a real religion, and the piety drop and no "religion-specific" rites will discourage that while also keeping some punishment to leaving a religion, although clearly not as harsh as before when you lost everything. While people are in this neutral religion though, players could already start choosing sides and fight against each other internally if they choose to.

Only thing that bothers me is the fact that piety classes (atleast priests and monks) become very weak due to this for months, and non-piety classes like barbarians, warriors, archers and assassins will kick their asses for breakfast, so it's not exactly fair in that way. That's why this idea pretty much relies on the real religions being able to be formed pretty soon after the shard is restarted.

[Quintoz]

That can be discussed, although tell us what would you expect.

Starting point: remove Tekstone and Nature due to the player base size.
What happen to piety of Tekstoners and Natures? Will they appear on Law and Imperial as if nothing happened with their full piety? For me there is no logic.

Argon

This is exactly what should've been done imo, there's no logic is our characters existing either, like wake up one day and all their power is gone because all the gods decided to fuck off, but don't worry we can rediscover them with time. Even if the story gets propelled a 100 years into the future it still isen't logical that our character just happen to exist.

If you can go against some standards of RP to cator to people who think spending 2-4 weeks training a character in an enviorment where nobody has a fully trained character then you should cator to the people who spend atleast 1 year in some cases more earning their 50 piety.

While I relize me argueing this matter is useless, I do want to know if the only religions that can be discovered are the ones we had? I'd much rather see if 10 players decided to create their own religion (Not talking about 1 RP post and 3 minutes of crying about it on ICQ like the whole Oblivion incident but people who put months of work into it)

[Argon]

So Quintoz, your opinion is that we should only delete Tekstone and Nature and have all those wake up on Imperial and Law?
Its not that you are propelled 100 years, is simply the fact that all 4 gods suddenly disappeared and some weird unique energy is still found which then can be refined into religions (for me at least makes lots of sense and opens for many possibilities).

While I relize me argueing this matter is useless

It's not useless.

I do want to know if the only religions that can be discovered are the ones we had? I'd much rather see if 10 players decided to create their own religion

It has been talked and I for one think yes, players could eventually work on new religions with same roles as Law, Imperial, Nature or Tekstones or something else.

Answer this:
1) What happen to piety?
2) What to happen to Law, Imperial, Nature and Tekstone?
3) Shall there be a neutral deity and then move to newly formed religions?
4) Shall piety be something that is not lost from now on?
5) Which solutions do you suggest?


Argon

[Quintoz]

So Quintoz, your opinion is that we should only delete Tekstone and Nature and have all those wake up on Imperial and Law?
Its not that you are propelled 100 years, is simply the fact that all 4 gods suddenly disappeared and some weird unique energy is still found which then can be refined into religions (for me at least makes lots of sense and opens for many possibilities).

While I relize me argueing this matter is useless

It's not useless.

I do want to know if the only religions that can be discovered are the ones we had? I'd much rather see if 10 players decided to create their own religion

It has been talked and I for one think yes, players could eventually work on new religions with same roles as Law, Imperial, Nature or Tekstones or something else.

Answer this:
1) What happen to piety?
2) What to happen to Law, Imperial, Nature and Tekstone?
3) Shall there be a neutral deity and then move to newly formed religions?
4) Shall piety be something that is not lost from now on?
5) Which solutions do you suggest?


Argon

I've always viewed Piety as your characters ability to spiritually connect to their god, I think the general idea however was that it was given to you by your god. But for a moment let's look at it the way that I have, in that scenario it dosen't necessarily go away when you switch religion (altho it does too avoid people jumping religions) because, again my view on it, is that a god wouldn't care if you gained power from them since you're worshiping them and doing their bidding, thus the more power you have the better of they are, no matter if the religion had 2000 piety it would never be able to rival that god, so win-win.

I think that even after a removal of the old religions new ones will be founded (or old ones rediscovered) to fill the roles we've had for such a long time just because history tends to repeat itself. Personally I would like too see a cap on 2 religions untill either the playbase supports another one (or two) or a group of players (10 or so) show proper dedication and good RP to get one created (obviously even if the playerbase supports more religions there needs to be good RP for them too be made)

I personally don't like the idea of neutral deitys simply because it dosen't feel like Pang, playing a religious character has always put you in the seat where you can be in danger but at the sametime you gain more power and responsibility (most Law and Imp answering maydays, trials etc)

I think maximum piety shouldn't exist, but it should be tweaked so that after 60 all it does is increase the duration of blesses, dangling a carrot infront of people is a good incentive too get more RP going. Basicly it would be like highten skills, useless but just enough that people would keep trying.

My main solution would be to character wipe :) but since that's out of the question I think my first paragraph explains my views pretty well.

[Vulcan]

I personally don't like the idea of neutral deitys simply because it dosen't feel like Pang, playing a religious character has always put you in the seat where you can be in danger but at the sametime you gain more power and responsibility (most Law and Imp answering maydays, trials etc)

Call it worshipping one of the vanished gods or whatever. The idea behind the neutral force is to allow players that do not identify with the religions created to still being able to play religious classes without joining one of those. The neutral powers are largely capped so there'll be of course a huge benefit in joining one of the factions. On top of that, it opens a door to a whole new guild system, but blckfire should be the one unveilling that when he starts working on it.

I think maximum piety shouldn't exist, but it should be tweaked so that after 60 all it does is increase the duration of blesses, dangling a carrot infront of people is a good incentive too get more RP going. Basicly it would be like highten skills, useless but just enough that people would keep trying.

Some things are still up for discussion, but so far the whole staff agrees that piety caps are a must and that piety should be given away more carefully, much like earlier Pangaea and not how it's been in late years. Incentive? Do it well or lose it.


By the way, there's a bug concerning ships that were placed on the map and so the slave (aka me) is spending hours walking every shore destroying all ships manually. So if you had a ship placed on the map, feel free to PM me and share it's location.

[Quintoz]

I personally don't like the idea of neutral deitys simply because it dosen't feel like Pang, playing a religious character has always put you in the seat where you can be in danger but at the sametime you gain more power and responsibility (most Law and Imp answering maydays, trials etc)

Call it worshipping one of the vanished gods or whatever. The idea behind the neutral force is to allow players that do not identify with the religions created to still being able to play religious classes without joining one of those. The neutral powers are largely capped so there'll be of course a huge benefit in joining one of the factions. On top of that, it opens a door to a whole new guild system, but blckfire should be the one unveilling that when he starts working on it.

I think maximum piety shouldn't exist, but it should be tweaked so that after 60 all it does is increase the duration of blesses, dangling a carrot infront of people is a good incentive too get more RP going. Basicly it would be like highten skills, useless but just enough that people would keep trying.

Some things are still up for discussion, but so far the whole staff agrees that piety caps are a must and that piety should be given away more carefully, much like earlier Pangaea and not how it's been in late years. Incentive? Do it well or lose it.


By the way, there's a bug concerning ships that were placed on the map and so the slave (aka me) is spending hours walking every shore destroying all ships manually. So if you had a ship placed on the map, feel free to PM me and share it's location.

In that case it sounds more like a placeholder for people who don't indentify with any of the religions that gets made which is fine.

I'm not saying it should be given out like candy but what am I saying is that if I'm 50 piety and I spend 2 years creating interesting plotlines and other RP that gets more people together, create politics or whatever while being a Second in Command and leading the religion forward I should be able to get a reward for doing so, currently the system dosen't work like that when you hit 50. I've also been in favor of 40 piety being GM regulated.

Oh and last but not least there's tales of a ship that is currently sailing the world after an accident with a recall, leaving it with only it's captain going around and around, every now and again it gets spotted but is soon forgotten.

[Ivan]

You might've heard this enough already from me, but I think special permissions for the religions should stop already. Example piety characters being completely overpowered with their blesses and pietys and whatnot.

Shouldnt pang encourage every character/player religious or non-religious to keep RP:ing and creating story line and stories and plots etc. Good example is that no matter how much effort I'd pour into the RP and stories and suchs, I'd never get the same benefits as a religious character, since the classes have been balanced that way.

All this complaining about piety and the work and effort people have put into gaining it, *claps* thats amazing, but shouldnt you do it for fun instead of trying to gain something to get more powerful than every other players on the shard?

Just throw the monks, priests and etc. into the neutral religion at start and give them 40 piety freebie, that should be enough with the basic rites to keep them from feeling "underpowered" (Heck even that is quite powerful in my opinion.) No explanations or suchs required (leave it up to player to RP out of it and by doing it correctly perhaps allow transfer to proper religion with reduced penalty from hopping) since there is no explanation given from the server for the itemwipe and downtime right?

and if there is no explanation for these things given by the staff I think it should work like this:

1) What happen to piety? - Move characters with piety to neutral religion with 40 piety
2) What to happen to Law, Imperial, Nature and Tekstone? - If no explanation given by staff, no one knows. Rumours about: Gods fighting and killing each others? or they moved to next world to fight their little war? Perhaps a powerful monster or character severed their connection to this world.
3) Shall there be a neutral deity and then move to newly formed religions? Throw to (possibly temporary) neutral deity and make players to create their own gods and religions.
4) Shall piety be something that is not lost from now on? - It signifies your own devotion and connection to your god (or something) so perhaps you'll lose the devotion but your ability to connect with the gods might stay.

Just my two cents and ideas for future.

(EDIT: The ability to explain and RP how the neutral god stuff works can be used easily as measure stick aswell, giving no proper story line from the staff anyone can say anything and perhaps create cult or two and have different opinions of what happened and create chaos and we love chaos dont we?)

[Baoler]

- Resources changes (ores/hides/bones) are meant to be more balanced and with a logic behind them
--- Ores placed in new spots

This has been a long time needed. Quite excited to see how the balance plays out for resources. Could be a game changer!
Will ore spots be rotated every so often or just this one time? I remember people mining the best spots then coming back to it every so often to mine it up again. Or at worst patrol around that area on their main to see if anyone else was trying to mine there. Maybe if the ore spots got rotated every 3-6 months it could mix things up. just an idea. Thanks for all the hard work!