Why is Magery so fail ridden?

[Toby Frost]

I think this should be addressed.. I personally wont even play a mage because of this fact of life. When I had 108 magery and 100 med it was to the point that I could attempt to summon 4 ellys and regularly still be trying to get the last one when the 1st is dispelling.. Which IMO is completely fucked, the fail rate shouldn't be nearly that bad but then again the hit rate for melee chars is so why not?????

Don't worry Bes if you complain about it enough you can always find a frat boy sounding turd nugget to tell you"Thats Pang Bro" and laugh all shitily "hurhurhurhurhahahurhur" but no one that can actually adjust it cares that these are the bullshit things that actually drive people from the shard.

It shouldn't be 100% by any means but man it should not suck nearly as bad as it does greater than 100.

[Cyrus Tegyr]

I think it ought to be 100%

Heightened class was never intended to be the standard, it was intended to give the devout player a boost. Clothing should be treated as such as well.

Getting your class's primary skills to 100 should not mean you're just beginning it should be the end with the ability to heighten and/or wear clothing nothing more than a boost. Though it ought to be noted I am a biased player in that I despise the whole heightened class system and it's implementation and indeed what is has become which is "the standard".

Not to high Jack but I view this for any skill not just magery.

I agree with your assessment frost, I've long grown disgusted of "that's pang bro" arguments, it's a weak way of saying the person does not want something changed or more likely fixed.

[Cyrus Tegyr]

I'll change my view slightly, perhaps not 100% success but it should be exceedingly rare to fail on a cast , maybe 1 in 18.

I'd also point out that failure could be changed slightly where there is chaotic effects that could happen where for instance a spell could go off successfully but also do something to the caster. I'm reminded of the 1 in 50 chance when opening a portal on Journey's end where you might open the portal but also summon a hostile daemon, sounds worse than it was but the magery system on journey's end had a whole chaotic include file that defined a whole host of things that could happen from singed hair when casting a firey spell to random daemon spawn here and there.but this could address a perceived over powerness of magery and at the same time add a depth to magery. Where many things were minor, nothing was life threatening but more of an annoyance and TBH I really miss some of that stuff.

[Bella Pious]

Everything seems comparative here. If we had no heighten skills, people would be happier with what they have. If there were no magic cloth, people would not feel so discontented with what they don't have. I don't think a skill at 100 should mean 100% success rate. Why? Because people make mistakes regardless how skilled they are. Mood, weather, health issue can all effect performances, and thus I understand the random failure/successful rate we were given in this game. In this logic, I don't even understand why with 115 skill anyone can have 100% success rate. Maybe they shouldn't.
And as far as I remember, Mages get faster casting speed and (I think) the more they cast, they better they get. It is understandable that Mages should be better at using magic spells than other magic classes. And the elly they summon are stronger (as I was told...). I think we should focus on how to distinguish Mage as the magic master, from other magic classes. I am not sure if the ellies made from scrolls can have different strength/HP depending on the caster's skills, but if there is no difference, I think there should be so even using scrolls the skills trained still make difference in outcome.

[Cyrus Tegyr]

I've thought about better ways to distinguish mages from other magic users and unfortunately my idea is just too grand I think but essentially the basic premise would be 1 of 2 things but they both involve giving mages a secondary spell book only mages can use that would essentially give them a 9th and 10th circle pages to go along with the original spell book.

Idea 1.)
Add 16 new spells that can be found only on mobs. Simple idea really and not that interesting.

Idea 2.)
Create a system where mages can create 16 new spells by combining Words of Power as well as different ingredients maybe including certain gems or pagan reagents but definitely including at the least normal reagents dependent on the combination of words they combine. This specific idea has been ping ponging around my head for two years now. It's fairly in depth and I haven't given it a good write up and this is a basic description of it but you get the idea.

The issue with Magery is that at least half the spells are useless and the useful ones other classes with their own spells also have access to the magery spells albeit not as strong I suppose.

[Glarundis]

The problem with that is that if we give them a secondary spellbook, then they become once again a specialization of a mage, just like the druid and the necromancer are. And once they are specialized, why should they still receive bonuses on their normal spells over the other classes?

Imo, i think the way they boosted mages was the way to go. nothing new for them, but they are better at doing the regular stuff than everyone else.
They meditate faster, they cast faster and their summons are a bit stronger, aswell as their spells. If this is not good enough, then i think we should boost these aspects even more, not make the mage yet another specialization.

[Bestia Domare]

Sorry guys but boosts for Mage is for another thread,
this thread was started just to discuss Magery, the skill.

As this discussion has continued I have realized an answer has been difficult for my original question as it seems answers and balance are mostly opinion based.
The spark for my original question was not "fail rate" but rather the effectiveness of Magery at 100 (or lack there of), I focused on fail rate because I thought it to be the main issue.

In order to look at this more relative to balance, I think a better question for me to ask would be these...

1. Should cloths be a requirement, or an improvement for Magery's effectiveness?
2. Do you find Magery to be effective at 100 (without cloth), why?
3. Should Magery be effective at 100?
4. How much more effective should Magery be at 105?
5. How much more effective should Magery be at 110?
6. How much more effective should Magery be at 115?
7. How would you describe the current difference between 100 & 110/115 Magery?

[Edward Sinclair]

Felt this way for a long time, ruined it for me- that all changed with scrolls and I got hooked onto them. I would never leave without scrolls and I felt they were something I would not lose sleep over if robbed or ganked by unkillable mobs. Down side is that they are not cheap and take time to make- considering that you're actually paying scribes for something it's not too much of a downside.

But overall I do find the failrates of imagery and macefighting for example, make the game less enjoyable for me to play. I prefer more skill than luck in a game but that's my preference.

[Bestia Domare]

we still fail medit too at GM !?
all these fail rates seem so unnecessary, *glares* ಠ_ಠ