The ridiculous state of PvP

[Kat Asherstone]

I cant understand how hard it is to decide a pvp situation, ignore all the bullshit from third party sources. Take the proof pictures and check them, if there is nothing wrong in them its a nay, unless proven otherwise. Rules are quite clear imo.

Besides only thing that you have to have pictures from is the RP afterall, its so simple that basicaly all people can whine about. Special cases like boats and stonewalls are mentioned in the rules and should be dealt with accordingly, ofcourse providing the one who accuses of player about suchs action has a proof as a picture of the situation. etc.

this has happened and some staff have ignored said pictures... I wish it was as cut and paste as it should be, I really do.

[Ivan]

We are not talking about stuff that has happened in the year 2002 here kat, shut up please. Im fairly sure that Im talking on behalf of many players who don't care to read your 10 posts per page with 10k letters in it.

Compress the things you want to say as most of us do, dont talk about old stuff because its irrelevant because of administration has changed already.

[Kat Asherstone]

We are not talking about stuff that has happened in the year 2002 here kat, shut up please. Im fairly sure that Im talking on behalf of many players who don't care to read your 10 posts per page with 10k letters in it.

Compress the things you want to say as most of us do, dont talk about old stuff because its irrelevant because of administration has changed already.

2013 is the dated photo's in question...any other bullshit you wanna try and throw out?

Do you even know the purpose of a TLDR?
So lazy fucks can skip to the bottom... that IS the compressed version... lols

[Cruxis Bane]

Honestly its a simple check list to go through...

Did the ss get posted in time frame site says
Does the pictures have halt on the screen with the victim in it.
Does the victim run.
If victim doesnt is there proper rp done stating reasons etc.
Are the passages if in a dungeon unblocked before and during rp.
Any special rules that need to be assessed or screens from the victim.

Thats a rough list which takes just couple mins to go through. Honestly should make all pvp like robbing where screens have to be uploaded to site in certain time. It is hard with a small staff and time constraints however if gms are questionable on it they could ask couns who know the rules to consult, its ultimately the final decision of the gm. Think the main issue with past few cases has already been said not being confident in decision, flipping decisions, and caring too much about the players disagreeing.

[Ivan]

Imo cruxis making all the pvp pictures being uploaded would just add the workload. Robbery pictures sure should be uploaded the instant. But players should have brains enough not to whine about things they cant prove. The rule number 1 in pvp is to take craploads of pictures.

And Kat forget the old stuff already, its irrelevant when the case was closed. You just have to live with the decission the staff has made and thats it. Stop whining and crying like a little kid after losing a lollipop 3 months ago. Aint that clear enough for you?

[Kat Asherstone]

Imo cruxis making all the pvp pictures being uploaded would just add the workload. Robbery pictures sure should be uploaded the instant. But players should have brains enough not to whine about things they cant prove. The rule number 1 in pvp is to take craploads of pictures.

And Kat forget the old stuff already, its irrelevant when the case was closed. You just have to live with the decission the staff has made and thats it. Stop whining and crying like a little kid after losing a lollipop 3 months ago. Aint that clear enough for you?

Maybe it's not clear enough for you, I could give a shit less about the past in terms of a particular instance... what I do give a shit about is
THE ABUSE OF THE GM POSITION TO SUBVERT THE RULES.
When a GM uses his ability to "make the final call" to say... naw that rule doesn't apply or OUTRIGHT states, I will NOT punish that player for that particular rule... that's bullshit, when you say "quit whining" you might as well be saying... yeah it's fine for the GM's to let ANYTHING go...
How would you like it if someone corpse camped you, your entire crew of friends causing many of them to quit the game... you took screenshot after screenshot everytime and the response from THE SAME staff, never being given the chance to discuss, or turn in those photos to OTHER staff, was "Suck it up buttercup"?

If that wouldn't irk you and make you question the abuse of power of that particular GM then you're being disingenuous, and maybe you're doing it cause it's all about your precious PvP, but that's ok, I know having your lollipop taken away can hurt.

I use those photos' and KEEP THEM, as proof that it HAS, and probably WILL happen again...
That clear enough for ya?

[Palma]

Maybe if you guys could avoid arguing in this post... We need to fix stuff here xD

[Ares]

Honestly its a simple check list to go through...
...
Thats a rough list which takes just couple mins to go through.

It sure is easy being a wiseguy from the other side of the table. What you're stating just isn't the reality.

And all you saying "you just need to get used to it and get it together" can go fuck yourselves. I'm telling you that this system is unsustainable, undesirable and things are going to change. If you don't like it, feel free to quit.

Kat and Ivan stfu or I'm forum jailing you both. Take your personal argument to PMs.

[Kat Asherstone]

Honestly its a simple check list to go through...
...
Thats a rough list which takes just couple mins to go through.

It sure is easy being a wiseguy from the other side of the table. What you're stating just isn't the reality.

And all you saying "you just need to get used to it and get it together" can go fuck yourselves. I'm telling you that this system is unsustainable, undesirable and things are going to change. If you don't like it, feel free to quit.

Kat and Ivan stfu or I'm forum jailing you both. Take your personal argument to PMs.

that's not a personal argument... that's a fact, Abuse of power happens, IRL and IG... every MMO has had issues of the abuse of power.. I'm just stating "as a fact"
I have proof it has happened here, and for someone to say "Don't talk about it" is just unbelievable... it's part of what has allowed THIS particular issue to arise, the relaxed stance on the rules in regards to PvP

The first thing that should be done is to look at HOW, we got here... What changes were made, what rules were relaxed to get us to this point, and if me pointing out GM abuse of "final call" is a bad thing and HELPED to get us to this point, then screw it, I'm the bad guy... but SOMEONE has to call a spade a spade if no one else is willing to. That's not a personal thing against Ivan, I'm just insulted that ANYONE would try and say "shhh, we don't talk about that here"... maybe you don't but WE as a server, if we really want to solve the problem... should be talking about it.

That being said... perhaps a type of GM PvP team dedicated to just hashing through the pictures and stuff to make a GROUP decision would be best, it would lessen the chance of any potential abuse of the "final call"

[Dillon]

This is all upside down here. There is nothing wrong with the system/rules, is the interpretation and the GMs atitude through all this the biggest problem.

All of us have a life, and GMs are saying this pvp issues are taking alot of their time, by your own fault let me say, Because you attitude are worng. You (GMs) should act like the referees of this game, making sure all players follow the rules. If some player found a way to pass by some situation, change the rule. For exemple, if we party A make a sucess gank on party B, GMs should evaluat the situation making sure it is legal.

Here some things i think could solve problems here: (some are forgotten)

- The attacker should provide the prove to make the attack legal, if the prove is not enlightening, the attack is ilegal. (video, ss, etc...)
- The attackers should keep the victim loot intact until GMs decision.
- The reason to start PvP should be evident and out of doubts. (Exmp: If player A "Halt!" player B, when player A can start attacking player B, runing, recalling, player B start the attack, all this should be clear).
- If guild/religion A declare war against guild/religion B, the reasons shouls be stated and avaliated by GMs. It cannot be attacks between both guild/religion until GMs decision.
- If player A is hunting with a pvm guild and his enemies come and kill him. The attackers should prove how they know their location (ss of truesight potion for exemple)

This are some exemples how to control the PvP here and take 5 minutes to see the proves and make a decision. And GMs should give their decision without fear. If a players kills other and dont have a good prove and cause of that have to return the loot, for sure the next kill he will be worrie to get a good prove.

Now the GMs should be impartials, corrects, and forget their pass ig afiliations.