Provocation

[Glarundis]

What are we supposed to do with this now?

first, the skill was already very slow to train. how on earth are we going to macro it like this?having to target the attacker and the victim before the char attempts, is not a good thing :F


now, it needs los. i agree on this one, so congrats on that change. but this makes it harder right?because then you must yourself bring the monsters together for the skill to work. now, when you do so, you have no idea if the skill will actually succeed because you haven't done it yet (you must target the victim before it starts, remember?)
another reason for this target change to not be a good idea imo.

then, the next thing. that some creatures cannot be provoked, it's not nice, but ok, we have to live with it, and tbh some creatures should be "immune" to it, so i think shaboolies and stuff like that are ok, because they have a higher will power or whatever.

but that the monsters won't attack others because they are frightened?that's why people use provocation, to make monsters attack others, regardless of the strength. if you really must have it this way, change the success/failure rates. instead of no chance on wanderer, few chance on gdragon and moderate on fiend, make it like 25 chance on wandered, 50 on gdragon and 75 on fiends. the skill itself will already fail sometimes on the other first target anyway (unless you have shifted the skill check from the first target to the second target?). these are just numbers, so we'd adjust them to a good level. also, if for some reason it should be very hard to provo against a gdragon, it surely shouldn't be when you are using dragons too! i mean, that small monsters are very afraid, i could get it, but monsters of roughly the same level?

bards are good for shielding, ok. but bards already are sort of forbidden from using harmful songs while in party pvm because it affects all. so bards cannot fully be bards while in group pvm. so they have some they can use in single pvm. that's provocation, a bard's thing. now it works like this? if provocation was somewhat good back then, it wouldn't do something that other players couldn't do. now, it will do even less

[Wolfie]

I am going to use jumping out of plan as an example. Even though you still have a parachute your still going to hesitate, so I can understand why something would still frightened.

And Glar, just because you can't seem to use damage songs doesn't mean they are worthless. You can always have the bard play, run in get 1 or 2 hits off then run out of the damage radius so your still safe. So they aren't completely useless.

[Glarundis]

that is mathematically possible, but i'm not seeing people do that. but about provo.

1- how to train/macro
2- los is good (even if it makes it harder)
3- adjust the numbers for the "afraid" component/also stronger monsters shouldn't be afraid of attacking other as strong monsters, even if they are very strong, it's a question of relativity
4- remove the target everything first, do the skill later! come on man!

i would appreciate if whatever bards we have on the shard could say what they think about this..
let's not ruin/make it impossible to train a good skill that the bard has

[Kent Strider]

Couldn't say personally, I trained provo to about 96 or so before the last time warp. Never again

[Corvus Albus]

In fairytales some bards could hypnotize only children with their songs, the rest was immune to the curse. :p

Why don't you add a way to choose your targets? The higher skill the better you can manipulate your songs targets etc.
For instance you can add a song of protection which makes a group of people immune for their songs for a time and then bards are useful again in group huntings.

[Wille]

There is no frightened message anymore. You simply fail to persuade some monsters to attack others. What comes to high end monsters, stays. Their power over the minions around is simply vastly more than your skill at provocation.

Also, a skill not being possible to train without human intervention is fine. You're supposed to train it yourself, not just wait for everything to train for you.

Bards are not just about provocation in PvM, and the skill is still useful. It's just not the thing you'll double team dragons, lotas and whatnot.

[Mike]

Well, I'm guessing Provocation was abused during DMS hunts up to the point it had to be nerfed. Can anyone confirm?

[Dargon]

Well, I'm guessing Provocation was abused during DMS hunts up to the point it had to be nerfed. Can anyone confirm?

No provo was used during DMS hunts. We dont even have a GM provoer like imps *hinthint*

[Mike]

Well, I'm guessing Provocation was abused during DMS hunts up to the point it had to be nerfed. Can anyone confirm?

No provo was used during DMS hunts. We dont even have a GM provoer like imps *hinthint*

I should've known...

[Zaradon]

Erh, due to the 'fixes' provo should be made a tad easier. The staff can always change it when abuse detected.