occupy wall-street/canada

[KrondorZuula]

Tbh i thought the guy that said "you shut the fuck up" was a tool

[Tyrion]

Ok tonight me and group of 15 people pulled out of Occupy Ottawa for our own well being. I will not speak on behalf of US or other Canadian movements but one in Ottawa turned into anti political march where hippies/homeless/jobless=anarchist gathering. Any political thought or group is being persecuted out of the camp area because people running to show are egoistic pieces of SHITS.
They are like hey look at cool shit happening in wallstreet lets follow them in anarchist ways, and nothing else. Imitating mother fuckers
That being said first day was marvelous there were interesting arguments and political views: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylkrcB3G ... embedded#!
ohh yeah I am the guy with ac/dc hat in the background, and the person saying " you shut the fuck up" is my new hero

Mmk, so regarding the video and that guys stance regarding NATO. Totally disagree that NATO is bombing "the country to shit." NATO has a mission to assist the Libyan NTC in the transition of power. And to be honest, the entire video seems to stray from the point of "Occupy Wall Street," movement. I know you covered that already but meh, this guy doesn't know what he's talking about and unless people are really up to snuff on their information regarding the situation, they can only act as if they know what is going on. The entire reason NATO was tapped for stepping into Libya was because of the claims of massacres occurring within the country. To be even more blunt, I think that they stepped in at a critical point to save Libyans from being indiscriminately killed by pro-Gadaffi forces. In comparison to Rwanda, Sudan, Darfur, Ethiopia and Somalia, I think a good-job is in order for NATO for halting more innocents from dying. I kinda hoped that something could be done about Syria but it is looking more and more likely that the Syrian people are going to have to take up arms themselves against the regime to enact any positive change in their country.

[Andoriel]

Hey in the end he clears things up a bit by saying he is against capitalism as an Marxist-Leninist and although he doesn't agree with Gaddafi, he is with Gaddafi because dude is fighting the same enemy(imperialism) . Occupy movements real main purpose is rejection of the system which happens to include imperialism and exploitation After 12 days of political arguments/thinking I am too tired to actually defend or crucify him regarding Libya, but yeah "technically" he is in the right place to talk about it. And what he did was brave, it takes guts to come to a crowd and defend something that's completely against what the main stream media tells people. Lets not forget Canadian forces are bombing Libya to "free" people soo there is little bit national pride is going on as well. For this reason his action alone made him my hero
And i was just pointing out at the beginning there were different point of views and groups of people there, which is not existing there anymore.(and ofc the fact that I am in the video by complete coincidence )

[Glarundis]

So what was Rwanda, Sudan, Darfur, Ethiopia and Somalia then?
NATO cares for its own interests.

[Monad]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3bhHYQ7i7w - Rather interesting point of view here aswell. Capitalist businessman supports the movement - he tells you why.

[Glarundis]

i sort of agree with him.it's ok that he calls it corporativism, i'd just called it the nastiest side of capitalism. he wants to go back to the pretty side of capitalism. and he says the movement does too.
that's where he needs to go a bit further.
there's no pretty side of capitalism, even if regulated. it will deregulate on its own. capitalism allows for some to very quickly gather more than others. and so, it is impossible to be kept regulated. because that would mean people couldn't do everything they wanted in the so called capitalism way of living.
it wouldn't be capitalism anymore (or atleast not how we know it).
it would just be a system which uses money=capital. which is where the word comes from. But such a system hasn't existed, not just for these past few years. It hasn't existed for more than a century. It's not a recent issue.


so what we would need is a very strictly regulated form of capitalism, and in that sense it would be so far from what we have that people wouldn't even call it capitalism even though money would be used.

[Mike]

so what we would need is a very strictly regulated form of capitalism, and in that sense it would be so far from what we have that people wouldn't even call it capitalism even though money would be used.

We need a fascist economy.

[Tyrion]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3bhHYQ7i7w - Rather interesting point of view here aswell. Capitalist businessman supports the movement - he tells you why.

It is an interesting POV.

[Andoriel]

Ok I am recharged now
As far as i understand he is defender of melting middle class aka small white business owners. He talks about return to origins of regulated capitalism but... I dunno capitalism in very very basic, accumulation of capital. It has no morals or social values, it only values human beings as their money is worth. America/Canada has/had strong middle class only because most labor power is coming from overseas. Small percentage of that wealth gained from over seas was distributed to middle class so every one was happy.
When i look at the broader picture I fail to see "regulated" capitalism being any different then what we have today because "State is tool used by the ruling class to suppress proletarians". Right now state is being used by the corpurations as a tool to increase their profits. And yes this is why the occupy movement started. Now lets say middle class revolution happens and we have regulated capitalism, its still the same shit. Sooner or later influence of the middle upper middle class will effect state and use it to change laws to serve their purpose.
Just saying this would end us with a cycle which will be the same thing we face today.
As for Gaddafi: if NATO attacked Gaddafi before 2003 I would totally be weaving the green flag myself. He wasn't the tyrant west media made him out to be, he actually followed socialist ways to support his people and oppose good ol uncle sam. After Saddam down fall he strayed away from his politics out of fear and allowed companies like bp start digging oil. He made alot of deals with the western powers, and destroyed the social structure of Libya in their favor. Basically in my eyes he betrayed his own people and digged his own grave.
Now i am more interested in what happens if(if they let him) his son goes to international criminal court and testify against uncle sams there
http://rt.com/news/gaddafi-son-war-crime-court-957/

[Quintoz]

Occupy Snakes Pass.